Comments for My Children Are In Danger: Page 1

Jesus' "brothers" - James as well as Jude, Simon and Joses - are mentioned in Matthew 13:55, Mark 6:3 and by Paul in Galatians 1:19. Since James' name always appears first in lists, this suggests he was the eldest among them.[14] Even in the passage in Josephus' Jewish Antiquities (20.9.1) the Jewish historian describes James as "the brother of Jesus who is called Christ,".

Paul refers to James, at that time the only prominent Christian James in Jerusalem, as an Apostle, hence his identification by some with James, son of Alphaeus. In Galatians 1:18 - 19, Paul, recounting his conversion, recalls "Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas, and tarried with him fifteen days. But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother."

While Christians believe that Jesus was, as the Son of God, born of a virgin, the relationship of James the Just to Jesus has been rendered difficult by the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox belief in the Perpetual Virginity of Mary, the belief that Mary's virginity continued even after Jesus' birth.

Now before any of you who do believe say that he's a half brother as some people believe. Wouldn't that have been a sin on Mary and Josephs part? If that's the case wouldn't the bible make mention of that?

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Jesus' brothers are mentioned in several Bible verses. Matthew 12:46, Luke 8:19, and Mark 3:31 say that Jesus' mother and brothers came to see Him. The Bible tells us that Jesus had four brothers: James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas (Matthew 13:55). The Bible also tells us that Jesus had sisters, but they are not named or numbered (Matthew 13:56). In John 7:1-10, His brothers go on to the festival while Jesus stays behind. In Acts 1:14, His brothers and mother are described as praying with the disciples. Later, in Galatians 1:19, it mentions that James was Jesus' brother. The most natural conclusion of these passages is to interpret that Jesus had actual blood siblings.

Some Roman Catholics claim that these "brothers" were actually Jesus' cousins. However, in each instance, the specific Greek word for "brother" is used. While the word can refer to other relatives, its normal and literal meaning is a physical brother. There was a Greek word for cousin, and it was not used. Further, if they were Jesus' cousins, why would they so often be described as being with Mary, Jesus' mother? There is nothing in the context of His mother and brothers coming to see Him that even hints that they were anyone other than His literal, blood-related half-brothers.

A second Roman Catholic argument is that Jesus' brothers and sisters were the children of Joseph from a previous marriage, before he married Mary. An entire theory of Joseph's being significantly older than Mary, having been previously married, having multiple children, and then being widowed before marrying Mary is invented. The problem with this is that the Bible does not even hint that Joseph was married or had children before he married Mary. If Joseph had at least six children before he married Mary, why are they not mentioned in Joseph and Mary's trip to Bethlehem (Luke 2:4-7) or their trip to Egypt (Matthew 2:13-15) or their trip back to Nazareth (Matthew 2:20-23)?

There is no Biblical reason to believe that these siblings are anything other than the actual children of Joseph and Mary. Those who oppose the idea that Jesus had half-brothers and half-sisters do so, not from a reading of Scripture, but from a preconceived concept of the perpetual virginity of Mary, which is itself clearly unbiblical: "But he (Joseph) had no union with her (Mary) UNTIL she gave birth to a son. And he gave Him the name Jesus" (Matthew 1:25). Jesus had half-siblings, half-brothers and half-sisters, who were the children of Joseph and Mary. That is the clear and unambiguous teaching of God's Word.

Louie on Oct 29 2008, 08:05 PM, said:
He was human born to a human woman, what is so strange that he may have brothers and sisters.
Does anyone know what was the average size of a family back then, how many members was the norm.

Child mortality was very high, families had as many children as they could, many of them died, and the ones who lived where needed to work in whatever job their fathers took. While the females where seen more commodities overall, having a daughter meant gaining land, livestock and grandsons, so every child was a blessing. I wouldn't be surprised if Jesus had 10 siblings, maybe more. I just don't see a bit of evidence that any of them where older then him.

Oct 20, '09, 4:45 pm

Michelle Arnold
Catholic Answers Apologist

Join Date: May 3, 2004
Posts: 4,215
Religion: Catholic
Re: Did the Virgin Mary have a sister?
Possibly. Scripture states:

Quote:
But standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother, and his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene (John 19:25).
Since it is unlikely that two daughters of the same parents would have the same first name of Mary, it is more likely that the wife of Clopas was a more distantly-related kinswoman.
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What About the Virgin Mary? (A Brief Catechism About Mary)

1. Why waste your time with a Marian catechism?; Jesus is the center of the Christian faith.

Is the moon any less important or lovely because the sun is the center of our solar system? Just as the moon is beautiful (yes, and beneficial) by reflecting the sun's light, so is Mary beautiful and beneficial to us by reflecting the Light and Glory of Christ.

Also, the New Testament has more material on Mary than on any other woman. That tells me that Mary is an important figure and that I ought to take notice.

2. What was Mary called among her people, and what does the name mean?

Among the Aramaic speaking Jews of her own time she was called "Maryam," the Hebrew version of which is "Miriam." There is some debate, but many scholars connect the name to a root whose meaning is "bitter." It was not lost on the early Christians, however, that the Aramaic form of her name could be broken down to two words meaning "Lord of the Sea" (Mar = Lord, Yam = Sea) which they saw as referring to Christ the "Fish." (The letters of the Greek word for "fish" were taken by early Christians to stand for "Jesus Christ God's Son Savior")

3. How old was Mary when she gave birth to Jesus?

We cannot, of course, say for certain, but a likely conjecture is between 14 and 17 years old.

4. How literally does the Church understand the doctrine of the Virgin Birth?

The Church has always understood that when St. Luke tells us (1: 27) that the angel Gabriel came to a "parthenos" (virgin) he meant it quite literally, and that when Mary asks the angel how she will bear a son since she "knows not a man" (that is, has not had intercourse) she was telling the truth. The Holy Orthodox Church, the Catholic Church, traditional Anglicans and Lutherans, as well as most conservative Protestant bodies believe the Virgin Birth to be a literal, historical fact: Jesus Christ was conceived in Mary's womb without the aid of a man and by the direct working of the Holy Spirit upon her.

There is, to be sure, a deeper theological meaning to the doctrine of the Virgin Birth in addition to the literal one. Almost everything and everyone in Scripture has a secondary, "typological" significance. In causing His Son to be conceived in an intact virgin, God was demonstrating that He was taking up His abode with men among "virgin Israel," that is, among the Righteous Remnant of His People.

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5. So, Mary has a symbolic, as well as historical, meaning as the Mother of Jesus Christ?

Absolutely! The early Fathers of the Church saw in Mary a personification, as I said, of Virgin Israel, the Righteous Remnant, out of whom was born the Messiah. Her very statement in her beautiful song of praise, the Magnificat, that "from henceforth all generations will call me blessed" recalls the promise to Abraham (and hence his people) that whoever blessed him (and them) God would bless.

To bless Mary (as did Gabriel, her cousin Elizabeth, and countless others through the ages) is to bless not only her, but also the Righteous Remnant of Israel to whom Jesus Christ came and among whom He first proclaimed the Kingdom of God.

The Church Fathers often call Mary the New Ark (i.e., of the Covenant). St. John tells us (1:14) "the Word became flesh and dwelt among us." If one translates the Greek into Hebrew the word "dwelt" would be "shakhan," obviously from the same root as "Shekhinah," the Presence of God that rested upon the Holy Ark. John is saying quite forthrightly that Jesus is that Divine Presence, but no longer resting on an Ark of wood, He "pitched His tent among us" in the Womb of a living woman of flesh and blood.

6. Catholics and Orthodox call Mary ever-virgin. Isn't the Bible clear that Mary had other children?

Does the New Testament say Mary had other children? Read carefully now. St. Matthew (13: 55) and St. Mark (6:3) do give the names of those it calls Jesus' "brothers," namely, James, Joses, Simon, and Jude. However, if you look at Matthew 27: 56 and Mark 15: 40 you will see both Evangelists tell us quite clearly that James and Joses were NOT sons of Mary or Joseph but children of a different "Mary" who is called both the Wife of Alphaeus/Cleopas AND the Virgin Mary's "sister." Now, it would have been highly unlikely in those days for two Jewish sisters to have the same first name, but obviously some close relationship is implied among all these people. It's really fairly easily solved: Alphaeus/Cleopas was the brother of St. Joseph, hence Alphaeus' wife, Mary, was the sister-in-law of the Virgin, making James, Joses, Simon, Jude, and the "sisters" to be Jesus' cousins. That the Evangelists call such cousins "brothers and sisters" isn't surprising but quite in line with Semitic thought where close kin were often called brothers/sisters.

Also, read John 19:25-27 (NJB): Seeing his mother and the disciple whom he loved standing near her, Jesus said to his mother, "woman this is your son." Then to the disciple he said, "This is your mother." Thus, Jesus gave away his mother to the care of St. John the apostle, which would be very strange and probably even illegal had Mary had children of her own who could have cared for her.

One must also take into account the almost universal belief of Christians throughout the ages that Mary, the Mother of Jesus, whom we call the God-bearer, was ever-virgin. The majority of the ancient Fathers of the Church believed Mary was ever-virgin, including Clement of Alexandria, Origen, and St. Jerome. Many Reformers did as well (surprisingly to most Protestants) including Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, and John Wesley.

7. Doesn't Scripture say that Joseph "knew her not until she brought forth her firstborn son," implying other children?

In the Old Testament it is written that Michal had no child until the day of her death; does that mean she had one after she died? Of course not! The Evangelist, by stating that Joseph did not "know" Mary "until" she had given birth to Jesus, is simply re-emphasizing that this was a virgin birth, a birth caused by God and not man. St. Jerome, a language scholar, explained that the use of "until" is a Hebrew idiom which does not necessarily imply Mary had other children. Even John Calvin believed "firstborn" simply indicated that Mary was a virgin, and agreed with St. Jerome's assertions about the use of "until."

As for "first-born," Colossians 1: 15 calls Jesus the Firstborn of all creation in God's image. Does this mean that there is a second, third, fourth born? That would be heresy. A first-born can be the only born. The term "firstborn" also had an important meaning in Judaic religion: The firstborn was considered holy and belonging solely to God as it was written in the Torah, "The first son that opens the womb shall be holy to the Lord." The parents had to "redeem" the firstborn son with offerings and sacrifice. Firstborn also is a synonym for "preeminent" in this ancient usage.

8. Why is Mary called "Mother of God (Greek: theotokos)?" Could Mary give birth to God?

Mary was declared the "theotokos," Greek for God-Bearer, in early Christian worship, and the title was officially made doctrine at the Council of Chalcedon in 451 AD. The term "theotokos" does not mean that Mary is somehow the mother of the Trinity, or that she existed at the beginning of time. Absolutely no informed or educated Christian believes this; it seems only those who would seek to mischaracterize catholic belief assert that we believe Mary is somehow the mother of the entire Godhead.

The history is a bit long and messy, but affirming Mary as mother of God has more to do with who Jesus is, than Mary. It has everything to do with Christ being fully God and human at the same time. Calling Mary God-Bearer simply affirms that Mary is the mother of the one person, Jesus Christ, who is both fully human and fully divine. This is all "theotokos" implies. Catholics, Orthodox, and the majority of Protestants accept the declarations of the Council of Chalcedon that call Mary "theotokos." This includes Anglicans, Lutherans, Methodists, Presbyterians, and many Baptists.

9. Can you provide quotes from the Protestant reformers calling Mary "mother of God" and "ever-virgin?"

Of course. Let's start with Luther:

It is an article of the Faith that Mary is the Mother of the Lord and still a virgin...Christ, we believe, came forth from a womb left perfectly intact. The Works of Luther, by Weimar, translated by Pelikan.

In this work whereby she was made the Mother of God, so many and such great good things were given to her that no one can grasp them..." Ibid.

Calvin agreed Mary was the Mother of God and that her perpetual virginity was possible:

Elizabeth called Mary Mother of the Lord... The mortal man engendered in the womb of Mary was at the same time the Eternal God. The Works of Calvin, Berlin, 1863.

Helvidius displayed excessive ignorance in concluding that Mary must have had many sons, because Christ's 'brothers' are sometimes mentioned... The inference he [Helvidius] drew from it was, that Mary remained a virgin no longer than until her first birth, and that afterwards she had other children by her husband... No just and well-grounded inference can be drawn from these words... As to what took place after the birth of Christ. He is called 'first-born'; but it is for the sole purpose of informing us that he was born of a virgin..." Harmony of Matthew, Mark & Luke, sec. 39 (Geneva, 1562), vol. 2 / From Calvin's Commentaries, tr. William Pringle

Zwingli (Swiss reformer whose teachings influenced later Anabaptists, although they were more radical than he was) said similar things:

I esteem immensely the Mother of God, the ever chaste, immaculate Virgin Mary. The Works of Zwingli, Corpus Reformatorum, Berlin, 1905.

The more the honor and love Christ grows among men, the more esteem and honor for Mary grows, for she brought forth for us so great and so compassionate a Lord and Redeemer." Ibid.

John Wesley, Anglican priest and founder of the Methodists (later became the Methodist Church) wrote this in a letter to a Roman Catholic, explaining the beliefs Anglicans and Roman Catholics share:

I believe... He [Jesus Christ] was born of the blessed Virgin, who, as well after as she brought him forth, continued a pure and unspotted virgin. "Letter to a Roman Catholic."

10. Zwingli used the word "immaculate" concerning Mary. Does this refer to the Immaculate Conception?

The Catholic Church teaches that Mary, who is "full of grace," and heralded as "the new Eve" by the Church Fathers, was without Original (and consequently actual) sin from the moment of her conception. The doctrine of the Immaculate Conception is a belief specific to the Catholic Church, although many Eastern Church Fathers believed in it. Pope Pius IX declared the Immaculate Conception dogma in 1854, after a lively debate among Catholic theologians. However, it is not accepted by the Eastern Orthodox, the Oriental Orthodox (Copts, Armenians, et al), most Anglicans, or any Protestant group. Nonetheless, the concept of Mary being conceived immaculately is first clearly articulated by Eastern Church Fathers, beginning in the Syrian Church, around the 4th century. The Syrian Christians even likely celebrated a feast of the Immaculate Conception. However, after Monophysitism overtook Syria, the feast gradually fell out of use.

Having said that, however, it must be pointed out that the Eastern Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox do call Mary the "all-blameless" and "all-holy." The Orthodox believe that Mary was born with a "tendency toward sin," just like any other descendant of Adam and Eve, and that at the Annunciation, when the Holy Spirit overshadowed her, Mary was completely sanctified. Thus while she may not have always quite understood everything Jesus was saying and doing, she did not commit any actual, willful sins. I have heard nearly the same idea expressed by many Anglicans and even by some Lutherans, both clergy and laity. Part of the division over the Immaculate Conception is that Eastern Christians do not conceive of Original Sin in the same way Western Christians do, as an inheritable condition. Thus, for many Easterners, there is no theological need for Mary to be born immaculately for her to be sinless. Some Orthodox theologians have even suggested the Orthodox would believe in the Immaculate Conception if they believed in the Western definition of Original Sin. Orthodox and Catholics seem to be getting at the same "mystery" that is Mary's role as Mother of God and her spotlessness as bearer of Christ. They disagree as to when it happened. Perhaps this recognition is a starting point for future unity on this matter? The Catholic Church celebrates the Feast of the Immaculate Conception on December 8.

One point to remember here is that, whether one holds to the Catholic dogma or the Orthodox doctrine, the cause of Mary's sinlessness (or all-blamelessness) is Christ. And whether she was totally sanctified from sin at her conception or sometime later, all agree that her holiness comes from Jesus Christ, not herself.

11. Was Mary Assumed Into Heaven? Is That in the Bible?

The Catholic Church, the Orthodox Churches, and many Anglicans, teach that Mary was assumed into heaven, body and soul. The Assumption was made dogma in 1950 by Pope Pius XII, but belief in the Assumption is much more ancient. Eastern Christians (including many Catholics) tend to believe that Mary fell asleep (died) before being taken to heaven. The Eastern Churches call this the Dormition of Mary. The Church Fathers relay stories of Mary's tomb being empty when the Apostles opened it up. Western Catholics conceive of Mary being assumed while still alive. What is the purpose of Mary's assumption? The Catholic Catechism states:

The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin is a singular participation in her Son's Resurrection and an anticipation of the resurrection of other Christians (CCC 966).

In other words, Mary's assumption is not necessarily about elevating the person of Mary, as it is a preview and symbol of our own future resurrection. However, special people are often taken to heaven in special ways. The Bible tells us Elijah was assumed into heaven. Moses was thought to be taken into heaven in a special manner, mentioned in the apocryphal Assumption of Moses, a work quoted in the New Testament Letter of Jude.

In answer to the second part of the question, the Assumption is not explicitly mentioned in the Bible. However, in Revelation we read of a "woman clothed with the sun," thought to be Mary in ancient Christian Scriptural interpretation. If this interpretation is true, then St. John attests to Mary's presence in heaven, body and soul. We must remember that neither Catholic nor Orthodox Christians hold to the Reformation tradition of sola scriptura, i.e. That all doctrine must be proved by Scripture alone. Catholics and Orthodox (and the early Church) see no contradiction between the two, and recognize that truth unfolds through Holy Tradition. Thus something hinted at in Scripture, like the Assumption of Mary, is more fully demonstrated by Tradition. The Catholic Church and Eastern Churches celebrate the Feast of the Assumption of Mary on August 15.

12. All of this makes me think, but, why do you pray to Mary? Isn't that worshiping her?

I'll let the early Father and Bishop, Epiphanius of Salamis (4th Century) answer: "Let Mary be held in honor, but let the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit alone be worshiped; let no one worship Mary" (Panarion 3.2:7). And yet, this early bishop has no trouble asking the intercession of the Mother of God.

If I come to you and ask you to pray for me, am I worshipping you? Paul asked the recipients of his epistles to pray for him; was he "worshipping" them by that request?

13. But I am alive, as was Paul's audience. Mary is dead.

So far you have been asking the theoretical questions, now let me ask you a question: Do you believe that what Jesus said is true? If you say yes, hear him now:

I am the Resurrection and the Life; he who believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and whoever lives and believes in me shall never die. (St. John 11: 25-26, RSV)

"Shall never die." That means that everyone who has "lived and believed" in Jesus from then until now is what? Alive! For as Jesus told the Sadducees, "God is not a God of the dead but of the living, for all live unto Him" (Luke 20:38 KJV). This includes Mary, the One who was the God-bearer.

14. But that still doesn't mean she hears us when we ask her prayers.

That has never seemed problematic to me. The saints who have left this earth are outside time and are "in God" who is present to everything and everyone in all times and all places all at once. The author of Hebrews in fact tells us "...we are surrounded by a so great a cloud of witnesses" (Heb 12:1, RSV), that is, surrounded by the martyrs and saints. The Church has always taken this quite literally. HOW this can be so is beyond my ken or feeble ability to explain, but if I accept the Word of God, I must accept that it is so. That the earliest Christians believed the saints could be asked for their prayers is beyond question. We have found at Christian grave sites from as far back as the first century itself, graffiti on tombs that say things like, "Aufidia, little daughter now with the Lord, pray for us," or "Matrona, dear wife, you are with Christ, remember me in your prayers!"

Granted, sometimes there have been excesses when people have gotten carried away and asked more of the saints (including Mary) than just their prayers, going against actual Church teaching on the saints. Neither Mary nor the other saints (nor God for that matter) are "holy vending machines" at our whim. This is why many Protestants (even those who confess belief in the communion of saints in the Nicene Creed) will not directly ask the prayers of the saints. However, many ignore the saints altogether (rather like tossing Baby out with the bathwater, if you ask me), but others like Lutherans, Methodists, and Presbyterians will commemorate the saints, either on one day a year (All Saints' Day) or on a specific memorial day for a certain saint. In which case the prayer used is often something like this: "O God, we thank and praise you for St. Such-and-such, for his/her life and witness. Grant us to follow his/her example etc." The liturgy of the Lutheran Church (surely the MOST Protestant of all!) even asks God to unite the prayers of the congregation with the prayers of God's people of all times and places. When you come right down to it and in spite of some nitpicking amongst the various churches, doesn't it all boil down to the same thing - that when we pray, worship, and intercede, we are not alone but are surrounded by the Cloud of Witnesses, are united with those that came before, who are still our brothers and sisters in Christ?

If you cannot, as yet, directly ask Mary to pray with and for you, at least thank the Father for her, for her openness to say "Yes!" to the angel, for her standing by the cross of her Son, for her being there in prayer with the Apostles on Pentecost, for her life and witness. You might even ask God to join your prayers and praises to hers and to those of all the saints of Heaven and earth, reminding yourself that you are not alone, but belong to a Great Choir of prayer and adoration.

15. This has been helpful. I don't understand it all, but I'm rethinking some things.

I hope I have helped. For me, as a Catholic, praying with Mary draws me nearer to Him whom she bore, my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. If Jesus is my King, then His Mother is the Queen Mother and surely is due honor for that alone, but more than that, I believe (as the Church has taught me) that Mary is also our Mother. When Jesus, from the cross gave Mary to St. John..."Son, behold your Mother," he was giving her to all of us. And what good mother does not love to pray for her children?

I would like to end with this ancient prayer in honor of Mary:

Rejoice of God-bearing Virgin, Mary full of grace! The Lord is with you! Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the Fruit of your womb: For you have given birth to the Savior of our souls!

Truly it is right to bless you, O God-bearer, for you are most blessed, most pure, and the Mother of our God. O higher than the cherubim! More glorious than the seraphim! Without corruption, you gave birth to God the Word: True God-bearer, we magnify you! +Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit: both now and ever and to ages of ages. Amen.

Written by David Morrison; Minor Contributions: David Bennett

Concerned father, I believe the story that was published but I don't believe the second part of it that your son is the first son of God. Something is misleading you my friend. If you believe in God now you have to believe in Gods' word also.
Many Christians downfall is the lack of knowledge of Gods' word and that is where Satan uses this to catch them. As a Christian I reject the fact that your son claim that the angels told him that his is the first son-they will never lie against God they also worships God and they are very loyal to God. There is something very weird going on there and you refuse to see it. So it is fine then you can go on believing what the Bible proof to be wrong, or you can wake up and help your son. The massage on his phone already said the words that "you will be mine your filthy thing" and seems like it is going to get what it wants because it leaded you already just where it wanted you.
I will just pray for your people so that your eyes will open for what's going on there. Read John3:16. For God loved the word, that He hath given His ONLY SON, that none that believe in Him, should perish; but should have everlasting life. That FIRST and ONLY Son died for us on the cross. You are a bunch of blind people that is leading each other to the hole that is dig for you by pure evil. Good luck. Trix
🤔

conceredparent, ConcernedFather and Mazza - I told myself I was going to stay away from your story. There is just way to much controversy on here for me. But now there's something I feel like I need to say, so just bear with me, please.

The people you are trying to convince are never going to believe you. It doesn't matter who else in your family or your neighborhood posts a comment on here. The people who don't believe you are never going to believe you. You're just wasting your time.

The people who already believe you don't need further convincing. They've probably believed you from the beginning. So you don't need to keep adding to this story.

By trying to convince the nonbelievers that you are telling the truth, that your story is true, etc all this is doing is creating stress in your home, whether you mean it to or not. (As BadJuuJuu has just pointed out.) This stress can create more negativity in your home and no one wants that for you, whether we believe your story or not.

Please, I'm begging you, please don't let your son post his story on here or add to the comments on this one. Please let this die here.

My prayers are with you and your family.

This is my first time to say anything on this story, but what I want to say is this- let it go. There are people trying to help you guys out privately via e-mail. Communicate with them, and accept the help offered. Ignore this site. Forget this site exists. You found help here, but you also found stress. You can cut the stress from this site out of your lives pretty easily by just not commenting or reading the comments of others. You have enough going on without getting upset over people on the internet. It aint worth it. Forget about this site. Focus on helping your son.

Hi my name is Paul I am conceredparent's husband, I didn't want to get involved but when I read the comments of the ignorant ones it's really disappointing how you could slag someone like that you really need to get a reality check. This is not what she wanted she only come here to get help not abuse wake up and look further into things before you shoot your harmful words off I was so shocked to see that a lot of people out there are willing to help and I tell you all now every word of it is so very true and I thank you all for your support and preyer's.
Ill cut a long story short as you all have read what happened, now at first when all this had started with our son I thought nahh his just dreaming but when the day he was being attacked in the bathroom I had never heard any one scream 😨like he did. It had made me wake up and see the truth that this type of thing is actually out there I too was like the ignorant one's that didn't believe, so what I'm actually saying is you just don't know until it happens to you, I am not slagging any of you as you are all entitled to your own opinion and I thank you for your apologies.
I assure you all that this is the truth and nothing but the truth so help me god.
Now for Mazza she is my step Mother these are two different people they are not the same sure some words are the same but they are not the same person there is so much more I would like to say but my wife has said most of it now I know you are all good people and once again I thank you all for your support and preyer's.
GOD BLESS

Concereparent the part of the first Son you can read in Colosenses 1:15-20 sorry I didn't mentioned that and if you want to read about the false profits go to Mathew24:11-There will come false profits, and that they will mislead people ext.

Concereparent, It's not wrong in Gods eyes when you decide that a person is wrong and hard as a rock and doesn't want to listen and everybody feels the same way about it then the word of God says in.
1Cirinthians 5:13
But then that are without Gods' judge. Therefore put away among yourselves that wicked person.
SORRY I DON'T WANT TO RUN AROUND WITH THE BIBLE UNDER MY ARM, I'm not that type of person but since Concereparent want to believe in God then I feel it is my duty to proof what's happening with her son to be WRONG and against the Bible-take it or leave it I will never put it down any ones trough. It's up to us what we want to believe in. Trix

Corinthians 1:14-15
And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of the light.
Therefore it is not surprising if his SERVANTS also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.
Sorry for this but Concereparent these things DO happen and if you want to be a Christian you should learn about everything-I'm still learning all the time.
In life there are always TWO things the one is affected by the other. Good and bad, God and Satan, Angels and demons. There is no in between it is rather decide to stick with God and the Bible and His authority or the other side you can't mix them. The truth for Christians lies in the word of God and that's why people get angry here because what you want us to believe is totally against it. I agree you can learn things from other churches but only if it is in line with what the Bible says. Be careful because you are desperate so you invited every one into your home to help but you will never know... It is like building a bomb, one wrong wire and everything can explode in your face. Trix

He himself is before all things and all things are held together in Him.
He is the head of the body, the church, as well as the beginning, the FIRSTBORN from among the dead, so that He himself may become FIRST in ALL things.

For God was pleased to have all His fullness dwell in the Son.

And through Him to reconcile ALL things to Himself, by making peach through the blood of His cross-through Him, whether things on EARTH or in HEAVEN.
Concernedparent, sorry I didn't want to bring the Bible in, but I had no choice now because you don't believe us. You believe in God now and this is why I wish to share this with you because somehow someway it seems like somebody is confusing you with all this poison they feeding you by making you believe something that is NOT true. There are so many things you don't know and I understand that you are also confused. I nearly wrote this of bus somewhere deep in my heart I feel I will give it a last chance. If this is a hoax well then well then I don't know what to say about that now. Trix 😢

I don't care about all these comments before me. I just hvae one thing to say.
IF this is really going on within your family, then you need serious help. If something is strong enough to attack your son and hold him against the wall, you better be by his side right now and not be checking childish comments on a website.
Go to your church leaders, they will know what to do (if they don't then try others).

If what you are saying is real then you are in big trouble.
I urge you to pray, try to make the atmosphere at home happy, watch a funny movie. Move on and get this dark experience out of your life.

You don't want to linger in a demon's playpen for long.
They don't sleep, they don't need rest. I have seen the result of almost constant attack by evil forces, It can break a man's heart and the will to live. Dont fall into that place.

Regards,
Gary

Wow the comments seem to be more interesting than the initial story! This story has really gotten people to take definite sides on the issue. I'm on the fence with this one. The story and posts sound so far fetched to me, but I can't dismiss the possibility there could be some truth in it either. I think this was a very good thread because people seemed so passionate in their opinions and statements.

zzsgranny, Thank you very much for your post & I also think you are right, we are only adding fuel to the fire. I had let it go for a couple of days but am getting negitive thinking from a lot of post. I thank all that have helped & are continuaing to help. God bless you all. ❤

CP and mazza: I don't think coming back here and reading these comments is very beneficial for either of you... All that it's doing is upsetting you, and distracting you from your #1 priority: your son and grandson... I can understand the need as a Mom and Grandma to defend yourselves and your family, really I do... I mean no disrespect, but maybe you should take a break from reading this thread, and just continue your e-mail correspondance with those you're comfortable with... The negativity could possibly draw back whatever it was at the begining of this, and no one wants that... ❤

look I'm at the point of why should I even bother here I'm gratefull for the help why couldn't everyone just listen to white bull I don't want to post anything else that happens but then I do because some day it could help someone else none of you know us you don't know we are the people that friends come too if they have a problem you don't know that if we see someone in need we help them without hesitation you don't know that we are caring and understanding people we tryed to be that here aswell but look how you are treating us I can contact those who are helping us and would like to stay but I don't need this nor does my mum we didn't dillibratly do what happened it happened to us this is not a hoax and we need help and this isn't helping I think maybe its time to just keep the help we have through email the people who have asked questions and had them answered and stay in touch with them I'm at the end of my thread and this negitivity and destruction isn't helping you all say your there to help people but what some of you and I'm not at all by any means saying all mean is that you only want to help people you believe the stories of and not nessecaraly the real ones like mine this is my story of the events that happpened to us and this is unfair when I trusted you all and asked for help I still have a fight to win not only with what's happened but with the emotions we are all feeling about what's happened to us I have to get my kids through this and my husband and I need to do this together and still be there for each other do you have any idea what its like to have your children afraid in their own home a place that they before this happened seen as a happy loving safe place do you have any idea what it felt like to not be able to protect your child because you didn't know what you were fighting do any of you do you have any idea what its like to see a child so terrifyed that he stutters and shakes and curls up in your arms for safty for you to protect him help him and protect him from any harm a child that has been so sick for long and thinking to yourself oh no what is this going to do to him so I'm telling you all myself I don't need this negitivity and non beleivers I have been through enough so enough already please I know I'm a stranger to you all and so is my mum but even strangers need help and that's all I was asking for and I'm still recieving help from a few you know who you are I don't need to metion names and drag you all in on this it wouldn't be right
God bless you all

Geez Mazzola! I know I said I would no longer post any comments to this forum but 'CRIPES' lady, give it a rest would ya? Every time someone says anything you come swooping back in shaking your fist, hollering at people saying "How dare you?!"and "You don't know, you weren't there" and "We don't care if you believe us or not because we know the truth!" yadda, yadda, yadda, blah, blah, blah! You're hurting your own cause with this behaviour so just let it go and it will end all on it's own. But keep coming back and all you're doing is throwing gas to the flames. If you continue to react over every little thing then you're no better than anyone else. Just walk away and ignore it.

To all of you that are taking great delight in nit picking everything that has been written go ahead. There is only one that can judge & that is God. As for the gramma or spelling misstakes when will you get it into your heads WE ARE FROM AUSTRALIA of cause our spelling is different. My daughter-in-law came here for help & she did get that help, from those that were very concerned about her family. She & I do not deserve any of this negitivity, as I said before that there is some things that left me thinking & I hope & pray that the angel that is talking to my grandson is from the light & not the dark side. OH BY THE WAY TO THOSE THAT ARE SO GREAT AT PICKING DID THAT EVER COME TO YOUR MINDS INSTEAD OF GOIING ON LIKE YOU ARE. Because I thought of it & I will keep praying that my family get the help that they deserve. May God bless you all.

Duality- I strongly urge you to read ALL of the comments for this story... This may clear some of your confusion...

What is with the negativity? The pointless negative votes, the harsh tones, the GRAMMAR checkers? What the deuce is up with people? This person came here looking for answers to her problems, along with several others (including me).

But she doesn't deserve the punishment she is taking now. This is maltreatment! I think people should be able to come here and not be harassed, but I think it is too late now. Think about what you post in the future - it won't look good, Whitebuffalo - this woman is in need of HELP, can you and anyone who has the courage to say no to harassment stop this outrage? P.S if you vote this comment with negative votes, you are just reinforcing my point. Thank you!

JarMan... WHAT? Please reword that so that I may understand exactly what you meant by that last comment. I personally have deleted NO comments on this story line.
Thank you.

look you can all believe my experiences or not either way we know what happened to us we were there you were not the people that helped know what I say about the advise I took is right what they did to help either way I do beileve in god so does my family we do believe in the power of prayer like I keep saying I said the truth of events that took place I didn't lie and I'm still following advise of those who helped and are helping its not for me to judge you its not for me to make your minds up its not for me to make you believe what we went through and its not for you to judge me either

Fiction. And that fact that the mods deleted comments concerning the validity of this story is ridiculous.

mazzaParent,
it is not the misspelling that bothers me, it is the fact that both of these posters have consistently misspelled the same words... Leading those of us paying attention, to believe they are the same person. Example; I took his "adviSe"---this example was obvious in both profiles... And the chances of two different adults making the same grammer mistakes...well, I'm going to follow WhiteBuffalo's request to take a leave from this thread. I have said all that is needed, and anymore input from me would not be of the positive.

OK. This has truly gone on long enough. SO many of us have tried to patiently wait it out, and it is now hitting that nerve. You all know which nerve I am referring to.

No, ZiShu, trying to get to the bottom of a Mystery is NOT grounds for banishment from the comment section. But it IS grounds for voting the comment down, if you so choose. As DC said there would be no further comments FROM Dc, I should think you have no further issues concerning this.

Community: Reading through all of the comments here, I can clearly see that there are NUMEROUS questions still floating around about this particular situation. I can ALSO see that those involved, personally, with all of this seem to be a bit touchy right now in providing those answers.
Perhaps it is time to take a break from this particular thread, allow time for healing, and IF you are truly interested in the outcome, come back LATER and ask in an appropriate "tone".
Let us NOT argue about assisting, receiving assistance, who gave that assistance and the petty issues that have arrived on the curtails of what would look to be a traumatic experience. You ALL have legitimate thoughts and theories on this. Let it go for a bit and await the final outcome.
Go to a different story and try to help in the meantime.
Thank you.

trix for the record I never once said iam christan I said before this happened none of my family beleived in anything I beleived in god and jesus but was christened church of england my husban was baptised but had no beleifs now my family beleives in the power of god and I'm sorry I told my story the way it happened to us you may be christian a lot of people may be but like I said I followed instruction of people who did believe and followed when I need help we found my entire family now beleives in god that in its self should say something some were of christain beleif some of belif in agels some of phycics some of spiritulism some from demonoligists some of protosten some of budism ect ect we followed all advise given is what I said and now what we believe is all religions are here for a purpose and when joined together I don't think any of you understand I don't think you know we knew nothing of the bible I had some idea but not to the extent I do now the power of prayer is amazing my family all agrees my mum told you all my husband was a non beleiver now is confident to say there is a god prayer does help ask and you will recieve as we did we asked for help and that's what we got I told you what the angels said to my son I didn't say we were saying it and announcing it to the world I simply just told how it happened

ZiShu, I said I was sorry except it or not. I will not fight about religion. I'm coming up for our Heavenly Father against this people because they said they are Christians but they put Christianity in a bad light with their story about the gate of hell ext. I am what I am I can't go with praying for anyone else except for God through Jesus because God says that EVERY knee shall bow for Him and that includes the angels and everybody even under the earth in the heavens and out space because He is the creator. You believe what you want and I believe what I want it's our free will in what we want to believe in God gives us free will. I'm not going to fight over it. Trix

Conceredparent, You must rather ask God for forgiveness making his Word to be lies. First son of God, sorry doesn't exist, God is 3 in one. 1) -God 2) -The Son 3) -Holy spirit. He will NEVER forget to mention a first son. He would have mentioned a first son, and then it should have been God 4 in one. If your story is true we need proof because you can't expect us to believe this. Sorry I can't be a pretender and pretend that I believe you because what you said as a Christian is against Gods' word. If you believe this crap then it is sad that somebody got it right to corrupt your thoughts so easily. I don't have time to comment any further I have to go now. Trix

good point mum we are from a different country to all these people that could be the problem here

* The history of the house - ancestry
Our home used to be one big farm and the park next door used to be aborigal trible land
* Any beforehand events (a s

Djod where do you get off we are two seperate people & our spelling is correct we are from Australia & we do not put a z in appologise sorry read our profiles & you will see that our emails are entiley different & why do you keep putting this bull about us being one & the same. I will not appoligise for both of us miss spelling some of our words. Take me as you find me or not at all. There are people out there that know the truth & also I am using my nick name & if you want to know my real name is Marilyn & I am a 59 year old grandmother & live by truth & love. So beware of who you call fakes & stop putting up here that we were taking advantage of all the goodness that we recieved on this site that has helped our family. Typing errors should not come into it.

You are welcome for the advice. How/when did the first attack happen? There are several factors to consider-

* The history of the house - ancestry
* Any beforehand events (a s

thankyou duality,
iam speaking with one, one who contacted me threw this site, I trust he has given me the right advise I trust in his faith and I know he is helping us, he has left a comment here also, I trust him fully and thankyou again

Can we please help this woman... Instead of correcting her 'grammar' errors - it gets annoying after a while when peoples lives are in danger - Pjod - sorry for the rant, I hope you can forgive me - I'm the same guy you fought in 'Shadows and a beam of bright light' - check my profile and you will see the truth.

Conceredparent - I think you should see a demonologist about your experience, particularly if lives are at stake!

i will not apologise for telling the truth but I will appologise if my statements offeneded anyone it wasn't my intention to offend anyone but I told what happened which is what I said I would do as for the story it is all true its our experience of what happened to us

i assure you we are two entirly differnt people but we are family I assure you my story is true iam not in a court like you say I'm here on the page I wrote my story of the events that happened to me and my family I assure you you are wrong iam confident people who helped me and my family know they did and will continue to do so. I trust that god will show you all the truth. And I will not be judged by him for telling the truth or wrongly accussing people of things iam happy and confident that Spirit of our God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, Most Holy Trinity, Immaculate Virgin Mary, angels, archangels, and saints of Heaven will guide and protect me keep my family safe from all that can harm us

one last thing concerned mazza,
You talk of my negativity and destructive posts... Let us talk of yours. You are a part of the problem. Your little faux drama, is an example of why those who really need help are not taken seriously. People who create fake tales, dramatize them to the point of being rediculous, are the very reason others with real such problems are afraid to speak out.
You should do the right thing, step up, and apologiZe to everyone on board who tried to help you, only to be made a fool of.

concernedparent...it is laughable that you are going to forgive me. Stop making a fool of yourself. The more you type, the more obvious it becomes... The very fact that both you and mazza keep putting an S in words where there should be a Z is proof in itself. Can you explain that, or will you continue to dodge that fact.

what is funny concerned, is you and mazza both consistently misspell words like realize and apologize. You just did it again below, in your last post. You both keep putting an S where there should be a Z. Why is that? How could two adults keep making the same exact spelling errors. 😁

it is ok. I expected such a defensive rant. I know, after comparing the typing in both profiles, that you and mazza are the same person. Not sure how you can defend against having the same exact grammer errors... Quite frankly, and not that you are on trial, but courtrooms are full of such evidence... When an expert is called in to compare writing styles and such.
The proof is there for anyone to look at... You just have to click your profile, read down until you get to the misspelled word adviSe... Then click on mazza'a profile, and read down until you find where she does the same. And that is only one example out of a few... No hate or negativity being thrown your way, just truth.

pjod, I for one will not apologise for something I haven't done. You are wrong. But it is your opinion to which we are all entitled to have, but its like this I'm not buying into your web of negitivity and destruction. Nor am I going to be upset with you, instead I will forgive you. Forgive you for your malace comments, your ignorance, your sceptism, your hurtful lies, your judgement, and your sarcasim. Its not your fault you wernt here, you didn't live it, you don't know any of us you just read my story about the events that happened to us and its human nature to question to find answers. I respect all of your comments but with all my mum, and my family and the people helping us have been through do you realy think we need this. I'm here to say no we dont, we don't need negitivity we don't need malace comments we don't need sceptism, we don't need the sarcasim we don't need hurful lies directed at those that helped and those of us that lived it. Like I said I forgive you god bless you with love, kindness and understanding

I personally, have already said that I am unsure in what role you play with this... Perhaps you have nothing to do with making up this story. It is very obvious when reading the two profiles of maza and concernedparent that they are the same person. Read each one carefully, and you will see they are the same, trying very hard not to appear as such. Do you agree Zishu, that the typing, grammer, and sentence structure appears to be the same?
Not to mention both profiles make common grammer mistakes... No doubt people have been duped. Were you also duped Zishu? Is that what you are getting at?

Brit Chick,
I do recall reading that post from you, and I agreed at the time... But wanted to give these two the benefit of doubt... Upon further reading of both profiles, there is no doubt they are the same person. That detail alone, washes the whole story, as far as I'm concerned. When I think of the time and energy wasted on all this... I am baffled.

Worried-Brit-Chick, I must say you're a very good person. I couldn't help myself when I read that first son of God... I just couldn't believe it. Do this people think my mother is a baboon or what? I agree with everybody else this story is a comic. Good night sleep tight. Trix ❤

Darkness, just always remember when you lose a friend then it was not worth to treasure that friend you lost, because your true friends will ALWAYS be your friends. NO MATTER WHAT they will grow old with you and never leave you-now that is valuable treasure. Many people will walk in and out your life, but the true ones will stay. Remember that. Trix 😉

I did kind of hint earlier that mazza and concerned parent seemed to have very similar styles of typing... I didn't want to sound like a b*tch though... Glad someone else has noticed it xxx

ZiShu, maybe I misunderstood you. Did you say that you prayed for the Angels? You have to pray to God and request for Angels to protect you. God is in control of everything and the Angels are not above God. God will decide over requests like that. You pray to God not to Angels. I don't want to get into a boxing ring with this if you mend that you prayed to God for Angel help, well then I'm sorry. Trix

Rook sorry I didn't mean offended you. It was not mend that way. Sorry that you were dragged into it in this way, but everything happens with a reason I believe. There are too many pieces left out in this story. I think that's why it is so confusing and gives genuine a very bad expression. Good luck with your mission to try and assist this family but I'm not buying this.

You know Rashidah, it doesn't take an expert to look at both of these profiles and see that it is the same person doing the typing. The energy that went into this hoax of a story is huge... And I can only think that the person behind it is in some serious need of attention.

I knew this story was B*ll from the beginning with the sudden appearance of a powerful demon.

Next time folks, do not entertain these authors.

not sure where this Zishu fits in, but you should be ashamed of yourself maza/concernedparent...it is so obvious to me now, looking at your typing, that you are one in the same. Don't try and defend against it... You will not convice me otherwise. There are a lot of good folks here that you have tried to dupe. You owe them an apology... And if I had the option to block these two screennames along with Zishu, I would not hesitate to do so.

maza and concernedparent
I just noticed in another thread, maza commented... And when she went to say advice, she spelled it as advise. To give someone advice... Is a bit diff than to "advise" someone on something. I noticed that you, concernedparent, also spelled advice with an S instead of C. I was going to leave this thread, until I just noticed this... And I have to now say, that I believe that you two are one in the same. Again, if I'm wrong I apologize... But two diff adults, making that same error, is just too much a coincidence.

no, not offended. It just appears to me like you are trying hard to disguise yourself by purposely misspelling words, that you later would spell correctly. If I am wrong, and you are one single poster, and not one person using a combo of screennames... My apologies. While I can wrap my head around an evil spirit tormenting your Fam's home... The whole angels/son of God/Lucifer...gate of hell? That I cannot. Sorry. It is not your job to convince anyone... So it is better to just let go. If your fam is in a better place, thank goodness for that. I hope it stays that way... Have a merry christmas!

zz-grany
How exactly was your son communicating with the angels?...Did they appear to any one else, and if so: did they appear as flesh and blood?...How did the message that the battle had ended reach you?.
By talking and no not flesh and blood. Flesh and blood are like us yes we all seen like a light a bubble a silloette the way I describe it is a bubble with the out line of a person thick white outline the light was bright... The angels told my son he said its ended and they won we can go home now and that its gone they defeated it

pjod I'm sorry if my spelling offends you but I'm not good at it at all. I'm not trying to be anyone I'm me and I was nevouse and terrifyed when I wrote signed up I thought I put concerned parent but when I tryed to sign in it so happened I wrote conered parent a simple mistake I'm not a good typist and don't use the computer much I think I may be pressing wrong keys I appoligise I'm sorry and I'm just typing I'm not stoping to think about things just posting my story and my thanks and my thoughts

iam sorry this has caused so much negitivity, blame,dout,and confusion, arguments and hurt. I did what I said I would do. I said id keep you informed and I did. I said id post the updates and I did or mum did for me. I put my e-mail up and a few used it a helpful few and I responded, I said id answer all questions and I did, I'm sorry its not what you wanted to hear, but it is the truth, Its what we all went threw and are still going threw. This really makes me sad that you all wanted to know, you all asked me to update you, and when I do you don't believe me, even tho I put my trust in you all. I put my family into your hands not knowing how to deal with this myself. I asked for help and that's what I'm receiving. I did what you all said to do and now that you didn't get the update you wanted you didn't get what you thought you would, you start to fight,argue,blame hurt me and question all that helped me, just from me telling the truth. Now tell me that's from caring people trying to help. I think not. I see in your comments envy of those that got credit for the advise and help they gave. I see hurtful childish stone throwing blame, I see questioning of beleifs of others dout, I see confussion as to why this happened this way and how people helped, I see a lot of arguing. Don't you all think for one second that I haven't thought about these same things you mention in your comments, Iam this boys mother iam living this with him as we speak. Of course I have, and its all worrying, frightening, and all so weird to me too. But hey this thing made us do exactly what you are all doing here. I tryed to prove my story but you still dout and some are quite cruel in there comments. I wish you would all stop with this negitivity I realise you all have an opinion to express but could you do it tackfully without all the hurtfulness blame and dout.
god bless you all protect you all and keep you all safe I wish you all goodness and kindness

I have noticed one thing a bit odd...
ConcernedParent has gone out of her way to misspell. Misspelling her title name... And words that she later spelled correctly. Not sure why one would go out of their way to misspell words, unless they were trying to appear to be different from another poster. This detail alone has me very sceptical.

CP and Mazza: I'm truely happy that you're situation has improved... But going back over the updates from CP, I have a few questions... Please don't be offended, I'm merely curious, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to...

How exactly was your son communicating with the angels?...Did they appear to any one else, and if so: did they appear as flesh and blood?...How did the message that the battle had ended reach you?...Did ZiShu come to you in spirit, and if so, why were you under the imperession that he was a she?...I ask that last question because of ZiShu's comment: "When I came to her... Many things happened"

Thank you for your patience

Mazza, Hun.
Let us talk Grandma to Grandma, shall we?
NO ONE is faulting you for supporting your family. NO ONE is faulting a frantic Mother for asking for assistance. NO ONE is saying your Grandson (step, or no- he is STILL Love Family)...
The thing that SEEMS to have so many upset at this point is the obvious.
I do not know HOW the information on the Grandson's supposed identity came into being, and that REALLY is not the issue.
The issue is, and I have tried to post this in a manner in which makes it rather clear, but evidently it was not, though a few posters followed me and cleared up my muddled thinking for me a bit (thank you, peeps).
IF (in Caps) the prophesy is true...
DO NOT heed the "It is over" calmly reported fact. I can see that Jim is still working with the family, as so many of us still are. As Jim stated "progress is being made", and this WELL after a particular poster claimed that it was all over.
THAT, right there seems to be the major issue so many are having here.
No worries, we are still there fighting this thing off (personally, I could not walk away now if I tried. I am personally TIED to the situation), and those of us who are in this for the duration will remain steadfast. That is what we do. No one is going to "pull out" and leave your family in the lerch.
What SEEMS to be the problem is the misinformation that has been passed on, and the amount of acceptance given TO that misinformation (separate situation than what is happening within the neighborhood and home).
I must say this again~ Get the children in to speak with a religious leader of the families choice. For the PHYSICAL, and MENTAL well being OF those effected IN THE HOME, they NEED to speak of this with someone who has concrete knowledge in that field.
The thing was scared of the Priest?!? I would have sent the Priest right on in and up to the beast, NOT asked him to step off. IF (in Caps) he made it NERVOUS, perhaps HE was the one sent by the Good Lord himself to banish this beasty with the assistance of all the vibes being sent your way. BUT, the family having never been in situation before, I can clearly see why he was sent away; the family feared for his safety.
No one ever wrote if he gave it a fight, or just walked away.

The point is (this is for ALL, not just the family) we, as a collective group, seem to have accepted the Charmed, Supernatural, Ghost Whisperer trend of banishing something within a half hour period of time. Those of us who have survived such malicious intent, KNOW that to be a false representation. We KNOW it is an on going battle to completely rid, and banish.
It does not matter WHO helped, and why. What DOES matter is that the help was available, and so many rose to the occasion.

Again: I implore both the Grandmother and Mother to enforce a bit of talk time with a religious leader. If nothing else, perhaps this identity situation can be better explained.
For the record: My family has dealt with quite a few interesting situations. My son seems to be the one that is most receptive. In all the years of dealing with this from the Mothers point of view, never once have I accepted the first "solution" to why he can do some of the things witnessed. Even if ALL the signs pointed in that direction.
I can not imagine knowing that my son thought that he carried such a weight. He will NEED someone to help lift some of that off his shoulders.
PLEASE, get him (it would not hurt the rest of the family, either) in to someone to unload to. Find him someone who can iron this all out for HIM, and explain it to HIM.
Thank you.

Deane thank you very much for you comment I am sorry if I have upset anyone, but going through this with my family I think you can all understand. It has hurt me to think that people think that it was all made up & believe me there were things that happened that threw all of us for a six. I would just like to thank all the help that was given & it was all appreaciated by us all & has helped. They were not taking advantage of anyone & did truley did need all the help that was given. May God bless you all. Xoxo

My apologies Mazza, I understand you're defending your young ones and I commend you for that. I will no longer post my comments on this forum. Peace to you and yours, may you be forever protected and always in the light. Deane

Boy I can not believe all this. Who has the right to condone anyone that has helped my family. My daughter-in-law took advise from many people on this site & for that she is very greatful. I am sick of seeing where people are more or less called liers & making things up. As I said I was in phone contact with my family a lot through this as I am over 400ks away. I do not like seeing things like it being made up or frauds being put up on here. People that have not been through experiences at all can not judge. Our world is full of many testing things & no-one can judge if they do not realise what is going on. I wrote instead of my daughter-in-law because she had written & found that the comments she wrote would not publish, I did not put a lot up as she told me because I did not want to be accused of putting false statements up. People also have to realise that this was traumatic for the family & they were exausted as well. The spelling boy that is getting me my daughter-in-law wrote quickly as things that she remembered to put down were flying into her mind as she had not kept you all posted all the time. She had phone calls, emails & the works from people that wanted to help & with that alone takes time to do & let them know what is going on. The ones that have helped are the importent ones here, they were the ones that were kept up to date as well as she could. So the rest of you that are accusing of wrong doing to a plea for help that was answered I am not going to try & defend my family anymore. I know the truth & heard the anguish from my family & have also heard the relief & that is all I care about my family are being cared for & with their praying & asking Gods help is all I am worried about.

One of the many that will come? Are you a prophet now? Have you now envisioned yourself to be the great one? What's next in your little bag of tricks? Other than your massive God complex you are no different than any other human being, and for you to insinuate yourself into the lives of people in distress and convince them that your something or someone your not is absolute proof that your intent was to boost ego. You are pathetic.

Ahhh Zishu, funny how no one had mentioned your name during the whole deal, almost as if they were warned not to. You are not who you claim and to have you saunter back in like you've accomplished something but must remain humble is laughable if not overly unrealistic. Do not expect accolades for the unrealistic claims you've convinced this family into believing.

Everyone that hung on to the safety and protection of this family did what came natural when they found a family in distress. I find no fault in that at all. I still feel this family has been duped into believing a very miraculous occurance has taken place. They have had someone telling them what everything means and convinced them that they have been witnessing things that actually never occured. I'm not sorry I was here, I'm just disappointed that I didn't catch it before the damage was done.

JarMan
Compared to everything you read on here, why do you say my stories are wild and outlandish?
Somehow you have proof that I lie about everything I say.
There are some people on here that I've helped.

Trix
I don't see where you get the idea that I said I ordered Angels around. I simply prayed for the ArchAngels to help.
When I said due to my request, meaning prayer request. As a Christian you should know what that means.

I have not fed them any lies. The family found everything else out on their own.
It is for you all to believe it or not, simple as that. For the Lord is at work here, and this event is one of the many that shall come.

Well put DC I see where you are coming from, I personally did not want to get invovled with this situation I kind of had a sense it was going to turn out like this. Although I posted details on a poster who could help them, I thought I would sit on the fence and watch this one, after being on this website for probably just over 2 years you can see which stories are going to cause a big comotion. Better of staying out of particular stories I think, I don't want to lose any friends from this website.

OK, here we are again and not one peep in a long while from Zishu? First let me say that after sleep and thought I owe the family my sincerest apologies for the blame I laid at their feet. They were obviously victims of someone who plays at being an expert but is just posing as one. This whole bit of nonsense with him calling on the greatest of all Angels to come and fight for the family and giving them such hope at a time when they were most vulnerable has turned this whole process into a mockery. Second, rereading through the entire postings I came across a few things that should have been obvious to all but because we were concentrating on providing protection we were less than vigilant and it slipped past us. Things like how the original poster stopped communicating with us and handed that task to her mother-in-law, who only tried to help by passing on what she believed was relevant. I do have a problem with them not mentioning that someone else from this site was assisting the family, very exclusively I might add, and that suggestions offered them by others were being tossed aside without a glance. I don't know if that decision was made on their own or if it came as a suggestion from this "other" poster they had been in communication with. What I do know is that persons name was very conspicuously held back from these updates we received here and there AND it was very strange how our questions had to be repeated, more than once in some cases, before they would be answered at all. Almost as if they had to ask permission to answer them (that's just my speculation), and when it ended by a short note from Zishu, well, that was so... I don't know, it's hard to say it was rude because we knew that by now this family had to be exhausted and who could blame them for their silence at that time? It was the posts that came on the heels of that silence that put this whole thing into overdrive, I know, I started it myself. The things they were saying were... I can't say it. All that came into my head was "WTF?" followed by "Oh no you didn't!". After all that, we had to hear some crazed monologue about Archangels and the 1st son of God, the son as a gatekeeper holding back Lucifer, they shared a mango with the Archangels, and how they kept the priest away because they feared for his safety, etc, etc, etc. That's when it all hit the fan, and honestly, that's exactly what should happen when confronted with this foolishness. My mistake was accusing them of making it up from the start, that was wrong. I should have gone back then and found out where it had gone off track but I didn't. People even tried to warn me but I wasn't paying attention and just kept pushing it. Now folks, we can't let this change what is done on this site everyday, and that is offer up help and advice to those who come here in need of just that. I certainly did not want to diminish the efforts of those of us who went to the wall for this family just to have it thrown in their faces and accused afterward of being phonies or liars. That hurts me most of all, how all this was somehow turned around and the blame fell on those that did nothing but try to help this poor family in any way they could. We were duped guys, and not by the family. 😐

I corresponded with this woman, and progress is being made. Pleas pray for her. It is an evil spirit; no doubt.

http://www.yourghoststories.com/real-ghost-story.php?story=1866

For those interested, here is the beginning of the story. Check the comment section.

I agree with Rooks middle paragraph in the comment that follows my last post. THAT is one MAJOR concern, and then there is the concern that IF this boy is-- basically the same thing WBC said right after me.
I am NOT throwing the Bull Shiat blanket over this, I am expressing FURTHER concern over the health and mental well being of a young man who just eight short days ago was literally running scared from a visual ne'er do well.

Glad everything turned out alright. You are welcome. I would try to help ANYone who expresses the desire for it.
I would be overjoyed with the opportunity to ask this young man a few questions. After all, HE was the reason I first responded to the plea.
Thank you.

I have read all the posts now (didn't know about the second page since I am new to the website). I have to say I am highly leaning towards this post and many comments being fake like JarMan. How are all these different people involved with the family on this website? And why don't they take the time to write with proper grammar, spelling and punctuation? If you are that thankful for the peoples help, at least have the courtesy to add a period between your sentences. This has been a complete waste of time.

With that being said, Ibid's advice was actually very good and genuine for dealing with evil spirits. With devils like this it is usually a long fight, but playing Quran will make it go away as it is like beating it in the head with hammer. Some verses in the Quran may even kill it, but you may make an all out open war by killing it with other jinn. Chapter 2:255 (his second link) causes the devil to leave the house for one whole day. If you recite it every day it will never come in your house... His advice is genuine and not really a quick fix, but a long term solution as you can do this every day. Fighting off devils is a life long task anyway. I recite this verse many times (2:255) in the day to protect me from all kinds of things and it always prevents devils from bothering me at night time when I am sleeping. Of course when I say it, I mean God protects me after I recite this verse.

Sorry, I see she did post. I was searching for concerNedparent not conceredparent (no "N" in concerned)...

I actually believe your story a lot more now. Go talk to a priest to help you out. I have submitted a story/post to the website, hopefully they will accept it and publish it. Please read this story as it will explain a lot to what is going on with you and your family.

hagi - I'm not sure you are looking deeply enough. The author HAS replied 10 times. Twice on this page and 8 times on the next page. Whether that makes the story more believable or not, I don't know. But she has replied.

I believe this sort of thing is possible but seeing how the author never replied to any posts it is obviously fake. Also, it would be the most aggressive devil I have heard of.

This story is very confusing to me. Somethings just do not add up. Especially with the part where, out of the blue, a demon comes in scratching up your son for no apparent reason.

Where exactly is it?

Was the door locked? Is that the reason why he could not of opened it?

As for the phone call. This can be one of his psychotic friends or stalker.

Rookdygin,

Too bad. This thing just ended up turning into a giant train wreck. I am pretty upset that I even started to believe this family's problems at all. I am pretty much writing off this entire thing as fiction.

Definatley a Demon get a priest to cleanse the house. And I'm sorry to hear about your son and the scratches may god bless you

Good luck with finding out the truth Rook. It all got a bit too weird for me with the talk of God's son, the devil, gates to hell etc. I trusted the explanation of an ancient entity who was frustrated and not able to communicate with words.

Let's hope the uneasy entity that was causing the initial disturbance isn't offended by the religious war type comments that have been made about it. The poster could end up with an even worse situation on their hands!

WBC,

To watch something 'simple' become what this has is beyond me...

Again I stick by what I said... There was an uneasy Entity... It did 'bother' this Family... It has calmed down...

But the rest of what is being said? Arch Angles fighting the forces of the Devil to keep a portal closed...CP's son being related to Christ (however it's being stated)... I am very worried that someone took innocent people in a very vulnerable position and totally perverted things into what we are reading.

I'm doing what I can (via e-mail...no mysticism here) to try and find some answers so that this family is really and truly helped.

Respectfully,

Rook

Rook,

I certainly wouldn't have thought you were a role player in this, I have seen how you always do your very best to help posters in need on here. That is why I commented to concerned parent that I hope they can live with themselves if this was a prank. Telling tall tales for attention is one thing, but enlisting the help of well meaning people such as yourself who care enough to become alarmed about the situation is an entirely different kettle of fish altogether!

JarMan...

Have you truly read through all of these replies... If you have you will see where I stopped giving credit to certain events and started asking questions, just like very many here at YGS.

So please go back and READ because I for one do not like being called a role player or being accused of lieing.

Trix,

I can understand your concern... And I actually have some questions on that point of my own... But first things first... My validation was based on a 'remote view' at least an attempted one... And I 'followed' the 'emotions' of the poster to attempt that... I then asked for a validation... Was told it was next door and then watched this thing 'snowball' into this...

For the record I never 'felt' anything like what is being described now. I stand by my original statements (take them or not) and I would love to find out just what has happened.

Respectfully,

Rook

Mazza, you and Concerned Parent have a very very similar way of typing. 😕 I'm not going to pick at holes in the things that have been posted here, as anyone can interpret the story for themselves as they choose, and I am not someone who enjoys arguments or upsetting people. I will wish you the best of luck for the future, and I hope you and your family encounter nothing but happiness from now on.

I guess like you say, believe or don't believe...let's just hope this truly is the end of it. I would be very wary of anyone telling me that my son was "God's Son" and as whitebuffalo says, I would be afraid that this title would bring him a lot of incidents in the future.

You seem like a close family, so look after each other.

All the best.

Ok just a couple of things like I said before believe or not that is for the idivdual. Second the house is real the people are real. I am not a beliver in lies that goes against all I was bought up to believe in. My belief in God & Jesus is still strong & that is what I tried to put across to my family. They are so greatful for the help & advise that was given to them through this site. Hey I do not think I am stupid or gullable & the fears that I heard in my family's voices were true. I am not a blood relation to this family I am a step mother/grandmother & I know their faults & their beliefs. But they are my family & they would not of put me through this for the hell of it. I have been through this from the beginning & my step son only rang me through fear & knowing that I would not be calling the men in white coats because of my belief. The family now realise the power of prayer & that things happen for a reason, that is why so many people got in touch with them. I am going to be the mother hen now I do not like seeing things put up here about them deceiving anyone, because my grandson should not gone through the scratches, the fear & everything else. Once again I thank you all for your help & I do believe that this all happened & there are so many people we are so greatfull to that have helped & I believe that their gifts are as real.No-one has taken christenanity as a joke & their are a lot of christians out there that should take a good look, as there are things that are said & done that no christian should do. I have been through this myself & there is only one person that should judge & that is God himself. Oh by the way it did not like the priest as this is why they were asked to keep him away until it was all over.

I almost got through all the comments, but have to stop here.

I am SO glad that you and yours (both Mama and Grammy) are now safe. I AM glad that the happy thoughts, prayers and correct people were lined up for you.
I need to caution you, though.
IF all of the comments following this story, on BOTH pages, happened JUST as you described...then, Sweeties... HOW can you say "it is all over"?
I am not going to straight up say this is a load of Back to the Future fertilizer-but I am about to post a Truth as I see it. If I offend anyone, I am soulfully sorry, but...
IF your son is supposed to be the First Born Son of God... HOW is this all over?
IF your son is the reincarnate (again, growing up in the Catholic Faith, worshipping on Holy Days-- I honestly can not recall ONE person who even SPOKE freely of reincarnation. However; I did not live in Australia, so I have no clue if the doctrines are taught differently there.) OF this Great Man...
Boy, I hate to fuel a fire, but just going by my own personal recent experiences (which I DO feel were directly related), there are a LOT of questions left unanswered for me.

Here is the thing. Those of us who HAVE a "Guide" have either learned to trust them, or to look into what they present. Those who have had their Guide for a while, know how to communicate, or receive messages rather clearly.
Those who do and CAN not, need to step back and make sure what it is that they are ACCEPTING as a Guide is of Pure Intent, and not just some ghost with an agenda.
I DO have problems with the "outcome" of this tale, but I AM going to give all the benefit of my doubt. I do not know everything, can not spiff off to join in the fight hand to hand ~ but something just ain't right in Smythzville.

IF all is as written (and honestly, step back and look at it again. If this were coming from someone else, could YOU swallow it without mulling over it a bit?), then you CAN NOT drop your guard.
All this confusion? EVERYBODY?
Is that not what the Great Deceiver does? Either solely, or with the help of others... Confusion is the first step to isolation. Is it not?
In Honor.

I am in two minds about this one. At first I really felt for this poor family who seemed to be in the grip of a terrifying event, as I said in my post before, it made my eyes water just reading it! However, after all the other stuff that has been posted I can hear the sensible part of my brain screaming "IT'S NOT REAL!" at the top of its little brainy voice.

I think it's lovely that so many are willing to immediately trust and help a stranger in need, but I think on this occasion the stranger may have been pulling your leg.

Concerned parent, you know in your heart what is true, so me believing you or not believing you is not going to make any difference, but I will say this: I would like you to take a few minutes to think about the kindness of all the posters who sprang into action to help you. If you have made this up or embellished it, then you have taken advantage of and wasted the time of good people who only had your best interests at heart, and I hope you can live with that.

If all these events did really occur exactly as you say they did, then I am genuinely pleased that things seem to have worked out for you and your family, but unfortunately I just don't think half of your account is true.

I don't want this post to sound like I'm "having a go" at you, and I mean no offence. I hope you can forgive my skepticism, as you said yourself you would have had a hard time believing any of this if you hadn't witnessed it first hand.

All the best.

If this thing gets angry when you pray then pray as much as possible. It gets mad because your standing up for yourself and it doesn't want that. Also I think praying drives it back. It may also be able to feed off your fear and upset feelings. These energies are almost food for an evil entity as the one you are having experiences with. But yes, talk to a reverend of some sort. Also no offense to anybody or thier religion but I hear they really don't like Catholic Priests. Not 100% sure but that is what I heard. The only thing that can drive this out is God, His love, power and authority. Because in the bible it says that even the devil does God's will. So keep praying and tell your family to pray too and ask the church to help you bless and cleanse the house.

Rook, yes I would like to say something to you too. I understand that you travel on the astral plane and I believe it can be done so I'm not saying you lie, so please don't get me the wrong way on this.
I can't understand that you ended up in the neighbours' house. If you couldn't get into Concereparents house because of the protection it doesn't make sense at all to me, because their house was protected against evil and yet you aren't evil. Unless... The house doesn't exist at all. I'm just curious.
Another thing is that to try and fight on the astral with demons... I don't know what to think of that, I would rather not say anything more because that part is too matrix and confusing for me.

Concereparent, I'm going to lay a view eggs here today. First when I read your story I felt so sorry for you and your family because I'm familiar with this type of attack you wrote about in your story. Now that I read your feedback I realised that you corrupted your own story by twisting the Christian religion way out of per portion though you claim to be a Christian yourself.
The only one that can stop Lucifer is God and His authority. Your son the first son...? Wow if that is true then all of us Christians can through away the Bible because then it is a book full of lies... Sorry but you insulted my religion as a Christian. Protecting the gate of hell? God will stop Lucifer and He will decide about open and closing of gates. Who are you as a human to make a joke out of the Christian religion like this, or is this a new kind of Christianity you created because it is not in line with the Bible.
Please tell geeta that I could also tell that she will life because she has the symptoms of peptic ulcer, but I'm not a doctor so my advice is that she should go check it out and maybe go for a bronchoscope.

Zishu, you come forward as a Christian. As a Christian you should know that God is in control of everything. You should also know that our Christians believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If the Holy Spirit is in your heart it will warn you all the time about good and bad. The Holy Spirit will lead you and give you the wisdom that is necessary to help you, and it will lead you to the right people to help you and your Guardian Angel is also there to protect you and you must ask for protection every day from God. He will order the Angels not us. It stays your choice if you want to listen or not. God doesn't demand anything from us. He gives us free will about everything we do. God control His Angels though. Yes it is true we can ask for assistance from Angels but through God only and he will decide over that. It's not in human power to rule the authority of God. Trix

Well I'm not willing to give this any credit for truth. Tell me, a Catholic, that a priest of my faith was willing to bring a weapon over to the house but changed his mind at the last minute? He provided you with holy water but you just couldn't seem to pick up a rosary or two while you were there? You know, I could do this all night long. Oh yeah, he said you weren't in his jurisdiction? Is that what they're calling it now? Puleeeease! You kids need to go out and get some fresh air and sunshine.

I agree that your spelling mistakes or gramma... Should not matter one little bit... And if you and your family are feeling better for the advise that has already been given and it is productive to peace in your home, then who am I to disbelieve your interpretation of what has transpired and let me make that clear... I don't believe you are all making this all up... What I believe is, that you are ruling everything in, when perhaps you should be trying to rule things out first and see what cold hard facts you are left with... You may be surprised just how many things have an logical explanation... The power of the mind and various other factors could be-causing a some of these experiences that are disruptive to your home... Best wishes.

Unfortunately I feel ZiShu is either a fraud or a role player. In any event, anyone siding with ZiShu on his wild and outlandish stories, immediacy discredit.

I can see rookdygin has some history on the forums and I did not outright disbelieve him or the story because of it, but now that has been totally and utterly changed.

I feel this entire thing, the people, the story and the events that have taken place have been all nothing more then one giant role playing event.

It doesn't really matter if the poster was able to confirm rookdygin's validations, because they could just all be playing along with the story and how it progressed.

Good session guys, I hope you all earned enough experience to level up, everyone did such a good job playing their role.

Boy there is a lot of sceptisim here isn't there. Oh well each to their own. I will tell you that a lot has happened that has thrown me for a six as well. Believe if you wish doubt if you like, it is up to the individual. Sorry but Zishu was helping as well so give him credit where it is due. I know this as I was talking to my daughter-in-law as they were communicating. The ArghAngels were there to help & my family's belief has been strenthened, by all your help. After my talk to them last night, there was a lot said that had me thinking now is this bit true or not of what was being said to my grandson, but it is not up to me to judge & I did come away with a feeling of calm. When my son rang me yesterday morning I asked him how the house felt & he said good all windows were open & curtains. The talk with them last night left me with a feeling of content as I did believe all was good & it was gone. As for the words my grandson was saying through the ArchAngels I believe that they were putting a lot of light & playing through the home to help my family to be calm after a very destressing ordeal. As I said believe if you want or don't believe if you don't. I for one do believe & even if a lot was strange to me, it does not change my belief & as I said to my grandson last night you have been given a very beautiful gift & use it wisely. I thank God, Jesus & all the ArchAngels & everyone here for their help & support in helping my family with all of this & may God bless you all xoxo. Please also I am a bit upset that someone has pointed out the spelling errors, that does not change the fact of it being true of not & we should not all be judgemental. We all know that the second comming is on it's way but we are not sure when. Also as someone wrote son of God we are all the children of God & it was not said that he thought he was Jesus.

Zishu...I believe you are a good decent man... Well intended and passionate in what you do... And I thank the author for showing some patients to her reply towards the skepticism given by myself and others, believe me I don't like to dish it out lightly... But if I am to believe what you are both saying... Then this is the beginning of the end and the second coming of Jesus Christ? Or am I reading this wrongly... Please explain it again just in case I've missed something...

Regards Daz.

i will let her know rook and I'm sure she will be ever so grateful and to all that don't believe what happened and think its so way out there I do too think its way out there like I said we didn't beileve this stuff before but we do now we have lived it truly amazing from one extreme to another but I swear its all true my neighbours will say its true my mother inlaw supported us by phone we flead our home and stayed away we have witnesses to these facts greeta galloway look her up on face book you will see for your self you see we do have witnesses in this but you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that

Ok...I would really like to give you the benefit of the doubt... But as some of the other posters have pointed out already... There seems to be another agenda going on here (revelations)...probably some of your story has some merit, but I think there's a degree of exaggeration to it... If I am wrong I am sorry, I would hate to walk away from someone in real trouble...but...the son of God... Big Call. 🤔

zzsgranny in answer to your question no we are not aboriginal I have spanish and english irish in my blood my husband has noweigen and welsh maybe more but yeah we arnt aboriginal

To add on to what ZzsGranny and DC have stated...

Ok, this is starting to turn into the plot for the 5th season of Supernatural. Anyone who has watched it can see the similarities on one of the comments below:
Lucifer will make a man a vessel. This man is a little younger than 35, dark hair, brown eyes, and dark clothing. Sam, anyone?
Micheal the archangel and other archangels will also take vessels. This also happened in the show.
A battle will be fought at a certain location. This also happened.

I'm not even going to get started on the whole "eldest son of God" business.

Normally I'm pretty polite on this site, and I like to offer helpful advice, but this is just too much.

A scrap of this may be real- there may be a negative force at work, but don't blow it out of proportion into what appears to be a Supernatural fanfiction. 🤔

CP: I'm sorry, I just read your second post... So ZiShu's angels informed you that your son is the re-incarnation of John the Baptist?...Is this the sister of Mary that you speak of?...

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but re-incarnation is not something that Catholics believe in...That's probably why the priest had a hard time believing YOU... And even though it is something I DO believe in, I'm having a difficult time digesting all of this...

I believe Rook when he says this entity has gone into a "hibernating" state...It's not gone...It's not going to be like in the movies where the bad guy turns to dust and blows away...

I'm sorry ZiShu, but I think you've done this family a grave dis-service by convincing them in their terrified state that their son is a DEMI-GOD!...I think your intentions are good, but really!...You caught them at their most vulnerable time, and fed them a bunch of garbage!...

CP: The ones who truely helped you were JimD and Rook...

ZiShu,

Please fell free to contact me via the e-mail address in my profile.

CP,

Again thank you for the updates, any and all information helps 'draw' a complete picture for those not involved...

Respectfully,

Rook